Episode 28: Bonnie Shay on Organizing Photos

business home Aug 10, 2021
Bonnie Shay knows Organizing Photos

Bonnie Shay is a professional organizer who built her business helping people keep their memories in order.  

Bonnie's offer for you is a great one!  When you sign up for her email newsletter (which is packed with value every month, you will get her bonus “Top 12 Ways to Curate Your Printed and Digital Photo Collection”

Resources Bonnie mentioned...

To hire a professional photo organizer, check out The Photo Managers

Connect with Bonnie on Facebook or her website  

Bonnie's favorite gadget these days has been to use Zoom to bridge the span of miles and build memories with her sister.  I'm linking to FB portal because it will do the same thing with video, but (bonus!) when you're not using it to talk to someone it becomes a digital photo frame. 

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This is a transcript of the This Mom Knows Podcast - Episode - 28

Jennifer Uren
Bonnie Shay is a certified photo organizer and has been curating large printed photo collections for 14 years. A typical client is someone who is overwhelmed with all their printed photos and just doesn't know what to do or where to start. So Bonnie helps to make those photos accessible, manageable, enjoyable, shareable and safe and secure now and for generations to come. Bonnie loves helping her clients and they often tell her that she works magic as they are truly amazed at what she does for them and for their photos. So welcome, Bonnie.

Bonnie Shay
Thank you, Jenn. Glad to be here and with your audience who will watch and or listen to this when they need it.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah, well, I'm so glad you're here. So the bio told us a lot about what you do, but why don't you tell us a little bit about you, where you're from, and maybe a little bit about your family.

Bonnie Shay
Excellent. So I live in the Chicago area. I'm in one of the northern suburbs, and it's not far from where I grew up. So even though I've travelled over time, I always come back and my home base has always been in the Chicago area. And I love it because it's sort of like halfway to one coast. And halfway to the other coast, we're like, sort of in the middle, right?

Jennifer Uren
Yes.

Bonnie Shay
And family wise, it's always been a female centric family. I have three older sisters, and I have two daughters who are 21, and 28. And even professionally, I work with a lot of women, because they're often the curators of their family photos. So loving women. They're awesome. And I'm a mom, as I mentioned. And the best gift is I did have to divorce about 13 years ago, and we're both very good friends. But we needed to be on our own paths. And about five and a half years ago, I met on online dating service called OkCupid. I met Frank, and we're now lifetime partners. And the beauty was on our first date, Jenn, within the first 10 minutes, I figured out that his two sons were friends with my two daughters in high school. And I went to high school and college with his former wife. So...

Jennifer Uren
That's crazy!

Bonnie Shay
...we're all good friends, we have Thanksgiving and stuff together when we don't have a pandemic that we're having to deal with. And we're just all grateful that we're on happy paths and together and going forward.

Jennifer Uren
Oh, what a blessing. That's really neat. Yeah, that is cool. Well, I'm glad you're here today. And we're going to talk about photo organization. So of all the things that can be organized, why photos? What was it that drew you to organizing those pictures?

Bonnie Shay
So you are your audience may or may not know, but I think that some of us have an organizing gene. We just are wired to be organized whatever shape or form something is. And so my former husband was a freelance photographer, and he was the artist and did the art side. I was the business manager for about 25 years. So I was already telling peoples stories through photos, just - in all those years. So when we went our separate ways, I needed to find out my own path for you know, generating my income. I decided to open up my own residential organizing business, because I'd heard about that being an industry. And I'm like, yep, I'm wired to do it. I love organizing. Let's do it. So I did. And then one of the first clients that I worked with, as we go room to room through the house to declutter and organize, you can imagine that we stumbled on the closet that was filled with albums of photos, boxes of photos, negatives, VHS tapes, neg, you name it, right? We all have that. And my client, Sue said, "Can you help me with this?" And it was like a light bulb went off? And I said, "Yes, because I've been organizing my whole life. And I've been working on photos and people stories for about 25 years professionally." So I paired the two things, my genetics and my experience, and it took off as a specialty. I did the residential organizing until about three years ago, when I realized I want to dedicate my life and my time professionally to people's photos, because they need help.

Jennifer Uren
Oh, well, that's cool. And that's I love that it it was such a light bulb moment for you so early on, because that's hard for some people to figure out what are we supposed to do? So that's great.

Bonnie Shay
Right, right.

Jennifer Uren
So much of our photos are now digital, and that is, you know, a whole different conversation. But with that in mind, do people have printed photos anymore?

Bonnie Shay
They do. And I sort of can categorize their photos in sort of three areas that people might have printed photos. First of all, they may have boxes and boxes of printed photos that they've taken of their own family through the years and that they've never done anything with. Alright, let's just put it that way. And then some people have their own family collection that through the years they did put them in albums because they wanted to organize them and have them available, but they're sort of have now stumped on, "well, if I only have one picture of each, how do I give this to my kids? How do I divvy them up?" That's sort of hard. And then also people have inherited their own parents photo collections. Yeah, so their ancestors. So and I have found through this pandemic that we're going through when we were assigned the sheltering in place situation, a lot of people were organizing their homes. And guess what? They went in their attics and basements and closets and spare bedrooms, and they found all of these printed photos that they had not seen in a long time. So they sort of bubbled to the surface, and people are finding them. So they're there.

Jennifer Uren
Yes, well, you've kind of described my photo collection in general. From the, from thestuff I had, and had in albums, to the things that were my grandma and great grandma's that I'm trying to figure out what to do with, but... So moms have a lot on their plates. So like you said, this idea of tackling the photos can be overwhelming. And the pandemic, you know, both gave us a little bit of time, but it also created a whole lot of new projects that are still sitting there waiting to be done. And I feel like the urge of the urge to organize the pictures usually, though, comes around a major milestone like graduation, or a wedding or a significant anniversary, or, you know, even a funeral the loss of a loved one. So, why, outside of this, why bother organizing them? Because if they're there what you know, in a box right now, what is it that's going to make caring for our photos? Why is that important?

Bonnie Shay
Okay. Basically, I am focusing I think, as you mentioned already that I'm only working on printed photos right now. I could do digital, but to me, number one reason to work on printed photos is they are the highest risk to be damaged or lost. I mean, look about almost seems like every day in the news, there's some natural disaster or Texas with weather that they did not anticipate. And the sad thing is that photos can be lost or damaged. Digital is a different story, because we can back those up. But if you have one print of one photo, it's it's the original. So to me, that's a big thing that I think people want to make sure that they keep their printed photos safe and secure. And we'll talk more details about that later. Also, I think as human beings, we may forget a trip we took with our family, or maybe our favorite red dress when we were five years old. But the minute you see a picture of that moment or that event, you're like you're back right there in a second, you can almost taste and smell and feel that red dress, and you just remember. And so to me, photos are a visual reminder of a memory. That's very powerful. And so people really, it's quite an experience to reconnect with your photographic memories. So that, to me is another important part. And then as you know, we've talked to a lot of moms, Jenn. As moms, you know, we think about having our children and that we will be leaving a legacy, just like our moms left a legacy to us if they're no longer alive. So to me, that's what the photos especially printed, that are a little bit older, are part of our legacy. And I want them to be safe and available and ready to go when they're going to be enjoyed.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah, I think that's all that's all really wise and good. When I think photo organization, though, I think I think there's several things I think about. So let's go through these, like one by one. So storage, do you suggest that you store in albums or photo boxes or something different? What's the most usable and safe way to store photos?

Bonnie Shay
Well, I do want to tell your listeners that there's not one answer to most of this, or one, it's not a formula, because each family there's different number of kids, different backgrounds, different stories. But I know in general, people like to reduce the footprint that their printed photos take up like we don't want to fill a room because it's overwhelming no matter what. So I find that albums are a little less efficient, space wise, because you can have 12 albums on a shelf and oh my gosh, it takes up a lot of room. So I typically suggest archival boxes that keep a reasonable footprint, but it keeps the photos safe.

Jennifer Uren
Okay, that's good. That's helpful. And then do you recommend keeping them chronologically or by event or by person? How would you sort them?

Bonnie Shay
Great question. And like I said, there's no one way although I do strongly advise people that I think as human beings, we like our stories to be told chronologically, like imagine when one of your children were born right? You have a picture of when they were born, and now you see them grow up through the years as they grow older and grow bigger, they lose their teeth. They get their big teeth, you know the whole story. So I really think chronology is really the best basic, General organization. And we don't have to get it down to the exact date. But let's get that general flow. And then always, when you have a specific project, like let's say, when you're one of your children graduates or gets married, and you want to do a photo book for them, well, you can slice your collection into just that person or your son played soccer. And so you can just slice it into his soccer career or something, but general chronology, I think is really how we how we how we run.

Jennifer Uren
Okay, yeah, and that sounds like that makes it easier to find the things when you're looking for it to so. Okay, so you you alluded to this, but keeping track of the data, the dates, the names, how, how should you do that? Write on the back of a photo, use a pen, use a pencil? How do you track the information? Because that's valuable.

Bonnie Shay
It actually is. And there's nothing like flipping a photo over when you're like, wondering what it's from or who it is. And there's some information. So I find using photo safe pencils are really important, because Sharpie markers, not to knock Sharpie, I love Sharpie markers, we all do. But they're not good for the backs of photos, because they could bleed through. So just be very gentle and not press hard. You also could take a sticky note and write something on and stick it on the back of the photo or on the front. I mean, they're not permanent, but they're really helpful. You definitely want to gather and we'll talk a little bit later about the process, because if you eventually scan, then we also want to collect this, this data as well on the scanned copy.

Jennifer Uren
Yes. Okay, great. And then negatives, what do you do with negatives?

Bonnie Shay
So I consider, Jenn, that negatives right now, let's say you have your boxes and boxes of photos you've done nothing with, but you have negatives. To me, there's a form of backup for your printed photos, right. But to me, they're very hard to look at, because they're small, they're negative, so you got to your head has to flip them around. And it's a whole roll of film, let's say 36 exposures, maybe there were only 12 pictures on that roll that were really of any quality. So I really say keep negatives until you're done going through your whole collection. And then most people let them go. You can scan negatives, but they're more expensive. And they're more, you know, just higher maintenance. So I typically people let them go unless you're a real hobby photographer and you want like top notch quality that's like museum quality. But for most people, even me as a professional negatives are superfluous at this point.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah. Because what who even where could you even go right now to take in the negative and get a photo printed?

Bonnie Shay
Right?

Jennifer Uren
You you use to be able to but now Yeah, they don't seem as as valuable.

Bonnie Shay
Yeah, well, and I just heard of one of no names mentioned, but a large franchise kind of store national store. They just took all their photo labs out of their stores, because they're not, they're just not getting the business. And they don't realize, you know, they realize, so I was like, "Whoa, that was a milestone."

Jennifer Uren
Yes, yeah, things are changing. So, so someone has just inherited, you know, 70 years worth of photos from their parents or their grandparents, you know, what should they do? So maybe walk us through the basics of what to do to begin to sort of figure out how to make it not so overwhelming.

Bonnie Shay
Got it. So maybe they inherited and maybe they have some of their own and this and that, and they've lived in their same home for maybe 20 years. Step number one is to gather all these printed photos together, they may be in various places. So I joke around with my clients, I'm like, well, let's play hide and seek, where are those photos hiding? Let's go find them. And so, because because many of us, we have lots of projects as moms, but sometimes the project that you don't really know how big it is, or you keep putting it off, it gets bigger and bigger, and you just get a little more overwhelmed. So by getting all the photos, at least in a physical central location in your home, gives you a better sense of what do I really have? How many do I have? What shape are they in? Whose are they? So that's step number one, pretty easy just to physically gather them all together. And then number two is I would want you to gather some tools together. Like I already mentioned, this photo safe pencil, some sticky notes, and even just some sorting boxes, and they don't have to be fancy boxes. They can be empty shoe boxes, or just plastic totes. There. These are more work in process. They're not that archival that you eventually may want to get.

Jennifer Uren
Okay,

Bonnie Shay
But get your sort of your supplies so that you're ready to go the minute you're ready to start. And then as we already mentioned, Jenn, we want to do a chronological order, but I want you to be very easy on yourself and let's think about broad brushstrokes, okay. Let's get a maybe by decade, maybe by year, but let's not feel like we have to get them down to that final date on the calendar that really applies to it. We want to get that general flow, the general story started in chronological order. And then what you want to start doing is we want to edit. So you might have just for conversation sake 10,000 photos. Even if you organize them perfectly and scan them and kept them safe. 10 1000s a lot. That's overwhelming. So I want to give you some good rules of thumb of editing your collection. And I'll ask everybody out there. How many of you when there was a free extra set of prints at the photo lab? Or maybe they cost 99¢? We said yeah, cuz I want to share them with mom and grandma and my sister. Well, that was great, then, but now there's extra in our box. So number one, and they're pretty easy to find exact duplicates of photos, let's let them go. Then you may have redundant topics or redundant content, excuse me. So let's say you had Thanksgiving dinner at your house and there were 15 people, well, you took 10 shots, because you wanted to make sure you got a good one. Well, let's pick out the few that are good. And let go of the redundant that really aren't good. And then the third category, Jenn is poor quality photos. Sometimes people were blinking, sometimes the photos were blurry, they were too dark, too light. Not that we need perfection, but you want to get the best quality. So let's edit out the stuff that really would not make the list of best quality because and you know, when we were little kids, we took pictures, and we chopped off somebody's head because we weren't able to get the camera right?

Jennifer Uren
Right, right.

Bonnie Shay
You know we all have those. Maybe keep a couple because it's a memory that you want to remember. But we can let go of many of the others. So we've talked about, you know, duplicates, redundant content, and poor quality photos we want to let go of. And I just need to mention that some people may think it's sacrilegious to let go of a photo because it's a picture of a person. But what I try to tell people is we want to get to the best of the best of your collection. Because if you have all of them, if you keep them all, it dilutes your story and makes it even more overwhelming. And so be comfortable with letting go of some, maybe you can mail them to friends and family, because that might be sort of fun, too. You know, we don't get real mail, let alone pictures in the mail, right. But you're gonna get your story and really get it manageable and really well told. Okay, so by this time, I sort of run you through the process of gathering photos and editing them. And now you're ready to consider scanning.

Jennifer Uren
Okay.

Bonnie Shay
Should we talk a little about scanning, Jenn?

Jennifer Uren
Sure, let's do it.

Bonnie Shay
So, um, scanning is a big process, because it's technology. And there's basically two big choices, you either do it yourself or you outsource it. And I find out people tell me that doing it themselves is hard because to get a good quality we typically as consumers don't have the right kind of scanning. Or if we have any kind of scanner, they're really slow and it would take you forever. So many people don't and they outsource it, which I obviously have one of the people that I do it, but I also sometimes outsource when I have been leaving projects. So I want to advise everybody if you can if you decide to outsource it because it's hard to do on your own. Stay local. Stay local. Because we don't want to ship your treasure mementos that are irreplaceable to somewhere around the country or even overseas. And even if you take them locally, Jenn, one really key thing is to make sure that company scans them on site, that they're not shipping them out to another partner. So not that they're trying to pull anything on you, they're being efficient, but I want you to be make sure that you can sleep well at night knowing your photos are exactly where you took them and they're not being being sent around. Yeah. So that's sort of the abbreviated version.

Jennifer Uren
Okay. Yeah, that's really helpful. I had to laugh when you said some people think it's hard to throw away their photos or or get rid of them. Because I was taught you never throw away a photo. So I'm cringing but my daughter, she apparently inherited that same gene when it came to her papers, and she couldn't get rid of anything. And so we finally she was about five and I made pictures of every family member and she put them in piles. Oh, grandma would love this picture. And my friend would love this drawing and I'd hand them out and I'd say, "You could throw them away. They just need to leave my house." And she felt better sharing but yeah, she could not throw things away.

Bonnie Shay
Right? And if I can give you maybe a little mantra that people could use, quality over quantity is what I emphasize. So pick the best photos that you have, as opposed to the biggest quantity. And so that's a good way to maybe start editing.

Jennifer Uren
Yes, that's helpful. So is there a difference between how we would approach the pictures that we inherit where we don't know a timeline? We don't know, a name maybe versus the pictures that we took? Or do we sort of guess and do the same thing and try to guess the time, you know, the, the, the chronal chronology of them?

Bonnie Shay
Right. It's fairly the same logic. But like you already said, you're gonna have less information. Unless you know, your parents and grandparents wrote a lot on the photos, you'll have less information. But let me tell you this, there's often many fewer pictures, the older they are. So you're probably going to be letting go of fewer, because you'll want part of your story. So that's something to keep in mind. It's not an overwhelming quantity. And believe it or not, sometimes it's a clue you get - play detective, I guess that's what partly what I am, I'm really a detective and a puzzle solver. The thing about being a detective and figuring out clues in the picture, or you know that the baby has one tooth? Well, they're probably between, you know, six months and a year, you know, so just sort of play with that it could be a game almost.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah.

Bonnie Shay
So yes, it is a general same, and you just can do the best you can with what knowledge you have. And maybe this concept will encourage people to do a lot of writing on the backs of their photos so that in 50 years, when their kids are doing what they're doing now, yes, we'll have that information that'll be just valuable and so meaningful to have.

Jennifer Uren
Yes, yes, I that is one thing, I will say my mother was always very good at writing on the backs of the photos. So we do know, but her her relatives were not, so we have a lot of pictures, we don't have any idea, right, which is hard. Now photos are obviously either meant to be seen. They're meant to be enjoyed. And one of your goals is to help your clients make their photos enjoyable. So what are some of your favorite ways to display or use photos? or encourage people to do so so that they can be enjoyed and out?

Bonnie Shay
Absolutely. In To me, the overarching concept to keep in mind, and I'm not I'm not against digital, I think digital are great for lots of reasons. But I think as human being something tangible is it gets to your heart. You know, I see a digital, you know, collection on a big TV at a party. Yes, we're sort of watching it in the background. And it's great. But it's I don't think it really connects to your heart or your memory as well as having something to touch and to pass around at a gathering. So a few ideas for that is print, print and frame hang up on the walls in your I mean, how many families loved to have a photo gallery in their hallway with their family. So you can print digital photos, and have your collection. Also photo books. And I'm sure a lot of people that are listening to this have made photo books or received them from trips or graduation parties or whatever. And the beautiful thing Jenn, technologically wise, is as long as you have the scans digitally you can design one book and make five copies. Yeah, like the the, you know, scrapbooks that people used to do, which were just gorgeous me you had to meticulously do every single page. And if you wanted two copies, you had to do it all over again.

Jennifer Uren
It was truly twice the work. Yes.

Bonnie Shay
It was truly twice the work. So to me. And in a digital frame sometimes, especially for elderly people who have a you know, maybe a small space to live in and do everything on a digital frame. They have them to still look at not as tangible, but something to look at. And then let me share one idea that a client of mine actually came up with so I gave her credit. She we scanned all of her photos that we had edited down and she said, you know, Bonnie, when I was growing up, or when my kids were growing up, we would tell them, don't touch the photos. They'll get fingerprints on them, don't - You, you'll get them smudged. And she's reversed that right now. She said you know what, she took a bunch of photos and she changes them every month or so. Put them on like a hostess tray and put them in her den by the TV. Whenever her grandkids come over. She encouraged them, and now they know what to do. They run to that tray and they look at the photos and they start asking, "oh my gosh, is this dad when he was three years old? Oh, Grandma, tell me about this. What were you making for dinner that night? I can't quite tell." So it's conversation starting and they're being loved those photos and it's almost a joy to have them have fingerprints and you know, a little extra loving on them. So yeah, and low tech, but I think it's a fun thing to do.

Jennifer Uren
Well and more than the picture they're getting the story and the memory themselves. And so there's more being passed along than just an image, which is fantastic.

Bonnie Shay
Yeah.

Jennifer Uren
So, so what are the benefits of I mean, you told us how we could do it, but what are the benefits of working with someone like you rather than just trying to tackle this project, you know, on our own?

Bonnie Shay
Well, I think what you need to think about, and it's a universal concept, we often are more successful in doing things that we want to do when we're doing them with a buddy. Or they're more fun. So like, Is it more fun sometimes to exercise with somebody or take a walk or a bike ride? Or, you know, your kids, maybe they're having a hard time with a project. So they ask a friend to help and they collaborate. It's just more fun, and it's more successful. So to me, that's a big part of what I offer my clients is I'm sort of their buddy, I'm their accountability partner, besides being the expertise that's going to help them. So what I suggest is people if they want their photos worked on either a) you know, hire someone such as me, and there's many of us in the in the world, let alone this country. Or b) pick someone that would be enjoyable to do it with. So a sibling, a parent, if your parents are still alive, your kids, your grandkids, and make it an event. It's not just a chore. We don't want to think of this as a chore, right, then that's usually less successful. Make it an event and make it something happen, then you're not only going down memory lane with this person, you're making new memories by doing this together.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah, that's great. And I'm guessing there's an element where having you sitting there working alongside or helping them you can give them permission to let go of something that they can't give themselves permission to do.

Bonnie Shay
Right. I love that. Well put Jenn. Yeah.

Jennifer Uren
Well, yeah. Sometimes I need that permission. Now, you do...

Bonnie Shay
I'll write your permission slip, if you want me to

Jennifer Uren
Thank you, yes, yes. You work with people in the Chicago area but what if someone is listening somewhere else in the country, and they want to work with someone? How would they find somebody near them?

Bonnie Shay
So I have an industry association, which I'm very grateful about. It's about 10 years old. It's called The Photo Managers. And we're a worldwide organization, most of the members are in the United States and Canada. But we have people in Australia and England besides other places. So we have an association. And I know we can give some websites later, Jenn, but they go and Google, The Photo Managers, you can by your zip code, start looking for information about who might be able to help you. And the beauty of it is that the the mission of The Photo Managers is besides us learning and having annual conferences, they help people find organizers. If you're a do it yourselfer, and you want to do it yourself. There's educational material, there are newsletters, there are classes that they can take, and if you want to become if anybody's listening to this, and they say, "Wow, I want to be like Bonnie," we encourage and we help people who want to start their own business and become a photo organizer. So just know that that's that's out there, you know, available to, to learn more.

Jennifer Uren
That's great. Well, you have, you've given us a lot of great options, a lot of good information. So distill it down to this for us, the mom that's listening that has the project and wants to get started, what is the first step that she needs to take today?

Bonnie Shay
The first step is, it's more mental than anything at this point, because you've probably just heard a lot of information that you hadn't heard before. And you can still be feeling overwhelmed. And what I want to advise you is that if you're working with a lifetime of photos, a) they didn't accumulate overnight, and all of a sudden you had a lifetime of photos. And so as a result, it's not going to be overnight, you're going to be done with the project and moving on to something else. So what I encourage you to do is to be very realistic, and reasonable on your expectations of what you might be able to do. You know, set maybe decide one chunk that you're going to be able to work on or put a date on your calendar, like you know, next Tuesday at two o'clock to four o'clock. I know I have those two hours. Let me go and I'll gather all my photos. So just figure out one step. Don't think about the whole project. But one step or maybe you want to reach out to somebody who you think could help you like a friend or a parent or sibling, but just be realistic in my favorite adage no matter what the project is, Jenn, I'm wondering if you've heard of this one before it's called. How do you eat an elephant?

Jennifer Uren
Yes,

Bonnie Shay
One bite at a time. Yes photo project is right there. Think of the elephant as your photo project and you want one bite at a time.

Jennifer Uren
Mm hmm. Because that's true. If you do two hours a week for the next year, you will have put in over 100 hours of work and gotten somewhere. But if you wait until you have 100 hours free to do it, you'll never do it.

Bonnie Shay
I love it. Well put.

Jennifer Uren
Yes. Well, thank you so much for being here. And as we wrap up, um, there's one question that I love to ask every guest. It's a little more lighthearted. And I'm a gadget gal. So this is my favorite question. But what is your favorite gadget?

Bonnie Shay
Well, I do have fun gadgets that I enjoy but because I'm sharing all this new information with your listeners, I want to share with them that's photo related, if I may?

Jennifer Uren
Sure.

Bonnie Shay
So we have been using all of these various platforms, zoom, and Skype and all these platforms, especially this last year. And to me, using that as a visual connection with somebody is just been awesome. And I'll share a few examples of what I've done that I'd never done before this pandemic started. I have a sister-in-law who lives in New York, and we don't get to see each other right now and she lives by herself. So we wanted to bake - we baked together virtually. We bake for like four hours. But we had our computers in the kitchen so we were seeing each other and at the end, Jenn, we actually had a pinch ourselves because we really thought we had been together. Because it was like we were so there right. And I've done a coffee with some of my networking buddies biz professionally, we've done coffees on Skype or zoom. And then I've learned to work with clients on zoom, because we're not working in person. And then last thing to mention is we have a Sunday night weekly call with Frank's family because they're all around the country. So visual, is just a level and a layer of heartfelt stuff that we can really enjoy and be creative about. So that's my favorite one these days.

Jennifer Uren
Oh, I love it. Yes, I what a difference that that is made. So how can people connect with you where they can? Where can they find you?

So my business is mariposa, which is butterfly in Spanish. As you can see, I'm wearing a butterfly mariposaphotoorganizing.com, and I'm sure we'll have it in the notes as well, absolutely. But you can reach me and look a bit more about what I do. And then I offer to anybody who's interested in talking to me or my services or have questions schedule on my website, a 15 minute complimentary phone call. And we'll chat and we'll figure out what the next step for you whether it's together, I'm referring to someone else, you name it, but I'm always here to be reached out to and share information and get you started in the right direction.

Excellent. And I know you have a resource to offer the moms listening today. And would you like to tell us about that?

Bonnie Shay
Absolutely. So I have been doing a monthly digital newsletter for I don't know how many years I've lost track. And it's filled with tips on printed photos and digital photos and all related topics. So if you would like to go to my website and sign up for that monthly digital newsletter, also a bonus is that you will get by signing up for my newsletter, the top 12 tips for organizing your printed and digital photo collection. So you'll have like a one pager that'll just sort of review a lot that I shared with today. Maybe some extra ones and then digital as well. So that's yours, you know, obviously no charge to keep and reference for yourself.

Jennifer Uren
Wonderful. Well, and I can tell the people listening. I've been getting your newsletter for years and it's always full of great information. It's, it's one that I have refused to unsubscribe from. So it's it's a good newsletter.

Bonnie Shay
Excellent. Thanks, Jenn. Appreciate it.

Jennifer Uren
Yeah. Well, thank you so much for being with us today and for sharing your time.

Bonnie Shay
Thank you for having me and love your platform and you're rocking it.

Jennifer Uren
Thank you

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